I made a list of changes I'd like to see in this game ;)

Share your thoughts and ideas about Mordheim: City of the Damned
DarkZany
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Joined: 16 December 2015, 00:34

I made a list of changes I'd like to see in this game ;)

Postby DarkZany » 18 December 2015, 09:30

Feedback Mordheim:
1. Make the Wyrdstones be swappable or allow us to drop or discard items from inventory to clear space for Wyrdstones.
2. Make Perception more meaningful
by making a sight range limit on line of sight.. so you can't see clear across the entire map with your eyeballs if you have low perception... this will give perception more meaning since more perception means you can see farther in a straight line as well as being able to sniff through walls..
3. Make the range of Charge be visible like Ambush and the telegraph should also indicate obstacles preventing charge.
4. Make a new Passive skill that allows a Ranged attack to be better able to hit melee fighters engaged in melee!
This skill should require high accuracy or high Ballistics Skill, and should also help make ranged combat more relevant
in the future if Elf factions are to be created.
5. Make facing be meaningful in some way with
vision/ambush/defenses, etc.
6. Make loading screens be shorter, please for the love of RNGesus.
7. Make the Disengage ability more clear when it can be used by showing the path that a character would disengage towards.
8. Please explain the ranged weapon mechanics more clearly in a
tutorial, it was really hard to hunt down all the info from online
forums and threads and there is still no clear explanation
how exactly is ranged effected by shields, armor, height, and melee combat. Please give us the numbers or formulas!
9. Please compile and make accessible within the game a Help/Info tab
that give detailed descriptions and explanations for game mechanics,
skills, spells, and mutations! I keep instinctively looking for this option whenever I don't know about something but it isn't there.
10. Turn orders keep getting switched around between characters with same initiative value DURING a turn.
This is annoying and makes planning things like Delay a gamble with RNGesus. I mean, it wouldn't be bad if you randomize the order of characters who have the same initiative at the START of a new turn... and then have that order be FIXED for the rest of that turn, so that when I look up at the turn order I can actually plan my ambushes and things properly without wasting SP to Delay and then actually not getting the right turn since I expected to go 3 characters later but it might end up being 6 because of how random it is when there are characters switching around their turn order DURING the round....

I am a youtube Letsplayer and I started my first letsplay ever on this game! And here's the link:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8D6gLR9 ... KV2YcCpQ0A

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Evan_
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Re: I made a list of changes I'd like to see in this game ;)

Postby Evan_ » 18 December 2015, 11:51

make ranged combat more relevant in the future if Elf factions are to be created.
I'm lazy to comment on all your point, but can't resist to pick this one... Ranged is viable at least, but I'd say it's brutal past the very early game. Especially on mercs, but lately I started a bow focused chaos team for fun (and to make nice pin-cushins of enemies.) Even that sub-ideal setup is really tough. The thought of elves in M:CotD gives me the shivers.. not that it's a bad thing, they do the same in TT too.

But I like your idea of awareness (perception?) limiting LoS.

DarkZany
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Joined: 16 December 2015, 00:34

Re: I made a list of changes I'd like to see in this game ;)

Postby DarkZany » 19 December 2015, 19:03

Can I please get a confirmation from a developer that my feedback has been read? I tried to consolidate all my suggestions into one post so that it is clear to see and saves space and time. I would say that some on my list are more important than others, but all of them I believe are relevant to improving the quality of the game. the top 3 priorities I think are: Loading screen time... being able to discard items or swap shards for Clusters while picking up a new patch of wyrd stones, and making the Initiative ladder stay FIXED instead of randomly changing DURING a turn, it is fine to change the order of same initiative units at the start of a round, but please don't change the initiative order DURING the turn, because that makes delay worthless and the whole turn is hard to plan out.

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thomas aagaard
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Re: I made a list of changes I'd like to see in this game ;)

Postby thomas aagaard » 19 December 2015, 19:55

swapping can be done... as long as your inventory is not filled.
Thomas Aagaard
9th Stirland Regiment of Spears...

DarkZany
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Re: I made a list of changes I'd like to see in this game ;)

Postby DarkZany » 19 December 2015, 20:24

Also one thing to note about development priorities. I think you guys made a huge mistake going the early access route. If you wanted to grow your game, it would have been better to start off with a closed beta with LOTS OF HYPE...HYPE sells your game... and by building it up until the real release date you get more hype during the time that you are getting feedback through your closed beta.

Currently I noticed that the latest patch was focused on having 30+ new animations.... I couldn't give a Skaven's butt about animations. I didn't come here for the animations. If a game had too much animations, I'm actually going to avoid playing it, because it slows down my computer or is too much of any eyesore with too much flashy graphics. What I care about is whether the game is fun to play, has depth, and has great multiplayer... and there are many glaring issues such as the ones that I posted that are FAR MORE IMPORTANT than a few more animations. If anything the charge animations currently don't even fit... why would my skaven do an overhead swing with his spear when he is CHARGING? these new animations take time and budget from your developers and artists and all those resources could have been better spent on more important things that are hindering your game from becoming more popular. THe loading screen is so slow that it probably turned at least 1/4 of your potential players off, and they just left right there. The fact that you can't even swap items when you are looting a Wyrdstone and have no way of dropping something in your inventory to free space makes this game feel like it's not polished, which it isn't... so before putting in more animations that dont' add to the value of the game, please fix the problems that deter this game from becoming something truly great.

Finally, please understand your target market. You are marketing this game to a bunch of top tier nerds who are extremely smart and need something mentally challenging. Most gamers out there are not like us. We like complexity and smoothness of game and reliability. The players who enjoy super graphics and eye candy don't usually play this type of game. Eye candy is for MMORPG players, Shooters, FIghting Games, and Casual Games. You are targeting STRATEGY gamers. Take for example, Starcraft. It was popular and even had a professional scene for 10 plus years during BroodWar... Starcraft II is now more eye candy and less smooth... playership went down. I would say Broodwar was the height of Starcraft. Broodwar lasted 10 years, and I am sure that towards the last few years of broodwar it's graphics was no where even close to the level of what other games were out there doing, and yet there was a professional competitive scene, there was a LOT of players there, and it is still regarded as one of the best strategy games ever made in the video games industry, and the reason for that isn't that it was a game that had a lot of flashy animations and graphics. People who play strategy games want things to WORK the way they are supposed to. That means fixing all bugs that affect game mechanics. A game also doens't have to be so complicated that nobody understands it. Starcraft was actually very simple and easy to understand the mechanics of, but once you understood everything there were a LOT of possibilities. That meant that newer players are not going to be turned off by a huge learning curve, and more advanced players can start to master new strategies and the developers can focus on fixing bugs and issues that come up in a timely manner.

Players who play strategy games create and read guides, and builds for the game, so that means they spend a LARGE amount of time doing research on the game mechanics. That means that to turn your game from something fun that you dicked around with for 2 days before moving on to something else more defined, you must make sure you have all your shit together with your game mechanics and to also make sure all information regarding game mechanics must be very readily available, not just on some obscure website on Gamepedia, but WITHIN THE GAME you need to have all the info within easy access. On top of that, in order for more competitive and serious gamers to take an interest in your game, you need to release info on the actual formulas of the damage, and etc. FOR EVERY INTERACTION you must clearly explain exactly and with great detail what the formula for calculating everything is. I am SO annoyed that I don't know how ranged weapons really work, and what limits ranged weapons and by how much are they limited by shields and melee combat, that I can't in good conscience consider using ranged weapons or spending skill points on ranged skills a viable option, and when you have such a huge hole in your game mechanics, there is no way in hell this game could become taken seriously by the more serious gamers who want something they can totally understand and then spend the time to master it and become competitive at it and maybe even have a multiplayer scene... THIS is the reason why when you go into skirmish mode, there are NO PLAYERS on skirmish mode. If this situation continues, after a few more months, when this game stops being "new", people will move on and take their time and money somewhere else. You really have 2 months. In february X-COM 2 will come out, and that game sure as hell will take a lot of the serious strategy gamers away from this game. X-COM 2 is definitely going to be very polished and have most of the game mechanics worked out and functional. That means that your game will die by mid February and only the most hard core of fans will stay, and that might be just a couple hundred to a thousand, but clearly not enough for a competitive scene to evolve. If you are happy with that and are ok with only 500 or 300 players online playing your game at any given time, then go ahead and continue to ignore the real problems in your game and go make graphics upgrades, but I know for a fact that once I'm done Let'splaying the 4 campaigns on my channel and X-COM 2 comes out, I will be switching over to that game unless there is something that is worth sticking around for, and that is going to have to be multiplayer for Mordheim, and the only way for there to be a multiplayer scene is if you fix all your mechanics and smooth them out, and then release all relevant information on every mechanic of the game. Players who play games competitively want all the information. Don't hide statistical data from strategy gamers (does shields lower the hit rate of ranged by 10%? 30% What is it?)... it pisses us off. We are engineers and coders, and scientists and teachers in real life, we want as much information as possible. Any hidden information about this game relating to mechanics will mean that it will be taken less seriously by serious gamers. And then you are only trying to impress the casual gamers... but Mordheim is a hardcore game... there is permadeath... why in hell are you trying to impress casual gamers and graphics whores?

I'm being very harsh by telling you the straight truth, but I actually really want this game to succeed, and I think that this game has what it takes to go far, but only if the Dev's are listening to feedback like mine, and are actually prioritizing their precious development time and resources towards what matters more to their player base. Stop dicking around with graphics and animations! I will play a pixel based strategy game for 10 years as long as it has extremely detailed descriptions of what every mechanic does and I can understand what all the damage formulas are... like does your dodge system just subtract from the enemy hit rate? What happens when I have 120% dodge rate? Is there a point to having that much dodge? As long as these things aren't answered, and as long as stupid little bugs that probably doens't take that long to fix remain in the game, this game will never make it big. Fix the issues, solve the problems, and reveal more information about all the mechanics, smooth out the performance and reduce the loading times BEFORE adding in new content and you will be able to attract and retain more loyal players. Focus on quality, not flashy eye candy that don't mean anything really in the long run. If I want eye candy I can just go watch porn or something.

I'm spending a lot of my days currently making Let'sPlays on Youtube, as a response to all the negative reviews on this game. So I'm trying to help this community grow here, and I personally have invested time to making sure this game succeeds. I'm being very brutally honest here so that if one of you reads this you can share it with the rest of the development team and take from what I say what you will. But as a strategy player it frustrates the crap out of me when things like turn orders get switched around while I'm planning my turns around that. When you open up the map, the turn order also is switched around... When you have units with the same initiative... their turns switch around randomly... etc. Ranged is largely undefined and unknown. There is no Help section in the game. And you go and make more graphics? -_- enough said. I'm tired. I still play Mount & Blade Warband to this day... take a look at what kind of graphics they have for their game... then ask yourself how important is graphics to your seriously hardcore strategy gamer.
Last edited by DarkZany on 19 December 2015, 20:43, edited 2 times in total.

DarkZany
Posts: 21
Joined: 16 December 2015, 00:34

Re: I made a list of changes I'd like to see in this game ;)

Postby DarkZany » 19 December 2015, 20:27

swapping can be done... as long as your inventory is not filled.
Yes but there's no way to drop items! you have to go back to your cart at your wagon to actually get rid of items and that is not practical! I hate having to lose out on the opportunity to loot a wyrdstone cluster when I have an inventory filled with shards or Fragments. Do I just NOT loot frags? Do I keep 1 slot open permanently so I can have the ability to swap?! Clearly this is not a logical state of where the inventory system should be... it's counter intuitive for me to not be able to swap out a fragment for a shard or cluster! When the whole game is centered around wyrdstones and gathering them and the difference could mean having enough gold to pay for a skill or send for a delivery, the stakes are pretty high! Not being able to loot when I want to really makes this game feel like a little kid who runs around and kicks people in the shins for attention.

DarkZany
Posts: 21
Joined: 16 December 2015, 00:34

Re: I made a list of changes I'd like to see in this game ;)

Postby DarkZany » 19 December 2015, 20:59

Also please consider MineCraft... sure it's a casual game... but even casual gamers don't really care about graphics when you give them a game that isn't just about eye candy but something that works really smoothly with everything well designed. Does minecraft have a lot of eye candy graphics and animations? Nope! But it's popular as all hell right? Think on that. WHY is it popular? Game Mechanics and how smooth and polished game mechanics is!

Focus on UX/UI, bug fixes, mechanics being clearly explained and suddenly your game will become relevant and playable.

Astralwyrm
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Re: I made a list of changes I'd like to see in this game ;)

Postby Astralwyrm » 19 December 2015, 21:05

They are on their christmas break.

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crimsonsun
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Re: I made a list of changes I'd like to see in this game ;)

Postby crimsonsun » 07 January 2016, 18:35

+1 to this feedback, though I can explain how ranged works and can tell you that dodge like parry is an entirely independent die roll to the roll to hit as is shown in your logs. Also in defence of the developers ranged was hit by the nerf back multiple times during early access as a direct response to the feedback because it was game breaking, even now its unbelievably strong if used well so I'm not fully behind you there.

Finally fixing perception in my mind would be done by altering the perception altertness bonus skill to provide a free test at a penalty and no penalty for the mastered version. I'd use it if it didn't cost sp which are always at a premium in my mind.

Critically I fully agree with all your comments regarding graphics and the market this game is for, I'm a hard core strategy gamer so I need to know mechanics and how they function and I must be able to see how everything fits together because hidden mechanics just make for shit strategy games. :roll:

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prag
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Re: I made a list of changes I'd like to see in this game ;)

Postby prag » 07 January 2016, 19:31

Load times and a pvp matchmaking system that reminds me of Warcraft II back in the 90's will be the death of this game.

I struggle to see myself continuing to play over the long term unless it becomes easier to find pvp opponents through the game (i.e. without going outside the game to schedule matches)

I have been waiting to recommend the game to friends until the load times come down to something at least somewhat reasonable. I feel like I haven't heard anything from the dev's stating they're working on this and that worries me.

I'm well over 200 hours played (and I have been on vacation the past 3 weeks and haven't played at all during that time) and think the game overall is good but I'm with the other posters in this thread that I really couldn't care less about how many attack animations there are. I was disappointed to get back from vacation to find that additional animations were the bulk of the "improvements" that had been patched in while I was gone.

I would much rather the dev's time be spent building even a simple chat general lobby for pvp so you can talk to potential opponents before creating a game lobby and crossing your fingers that someone shows up.

My 2 cents...


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