General feedback

Share your thoughts and ideas about Mordheim: City of the Damned
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Evan_
Posts: 46
Joined: 27 November 2015, 09:43

General feedback

Postby Evan_ » 28 November 2015, 10:10

Disclaimer notice: the game is awesome, unique, etc. I could throw adjectives all day. I'm just nitpicking here. What actually matters is more than fine.

- The most painful part of the game for me is the deployment process. It feels to take much more time as it should. Why can't I click a spot on the map to deploy a unit? Or just the mark ingame? Now if I want a specific starting position, I need to cycle trough a lot, occasionally checking the map if I'm there yet. And their order seems totally random. Hell, it would be better even if I could just walk each unit to the allowed spots.

- Why can't I just take the equipment off a badly injured unit and fire him without starting the treatment? It's not that saving those few gold pieces matter much. The workaround is letting him bleed out in a few days, but than he occupies a reserve slot. That matters less early game, while the GP cost is negligable from mid-game. Yet, allowing to kick the criples would fit the Mordheim mood imho, while being a nice QoL thing.

- I get the point of those 'zones' next to characters. It's a good mechanic. But why do friendly zones block the 'pick up stuff' or 'climb / jump down' actions? It's annoying, and I don't see why.

- Techical matter: I can't seem to be able to set a fullscreen resolution with 4:3 aspect ratio. Wasn't too big of a problem, I probably could have found a workaround if I did mind the letterbox. Just mentioning it.

- The ingame UI is usable, though I feel it has a learning curve... where all those indicators are hiding and what do they mean. I guess it's explained in the later sections of the tutorials, but the game is too cool to waste time there. A few tooltips would be lovely.

- The warband menu... that will be long... it feels as chaotic as the city itself. There are redundant pages and obscure looking sub-menus. It's pretty hard to mention everything that felt off, or counter intuitive, as one still gets used to those fast. Well, faster than we mere mortals master the actual gameplay.

The most obvious offender is the 'switch units' submenu. It's annoying, and it would be totally pointless if we could just drag and drop unit icons in the warband screen. Ahh, and it pops up before missions too. Why? We already know to triple-check party composition and equipment before launch, as it's really painful to make mistakes in those. And it shows the 'compact' character sheets. I wonder if there are players who can reliably identify their stats by icons. I just -always- use the 'big' sheet.

Shop menu: couldn't my inventory and the shopkeeper's fit in one screen? It happened to me that I confused those... costy mistake. Well, alt-f4 reverted it, but still. Ok, maybe I'm silly, but that's expected from us end-users. :) Also... I can reach the shop from a unit's inventory screen... I wonder how many of us found that. I wish I had trust in uncharted alternative menus, but I rather click more and use what I'm already familiar with.

Skills menu: it took me a while since I realized it has like 10 sub-menus for the rest of the skills, + other 10 for the passives. Guess it's the silly end-user again who prefers playing and experiencing instead of going trough all the tutorials.

Character sheet: Why can't I spend the stat points on the post-match screen when I receive those? It already cycles trough the units that were in battle, now I need to do that cycling again. Also, clicking like two pixels right from the 'raise intelligence' or 'raise alertness' arrows registers as a 'previous unit' click. Pretty annoying, especially if I don't notice the lack of confirmation popup and think it's done.

All and all, I believe the menu system is the weakest part of the product. That is good. I wish many anticipated AA games wouldn't have bigger problems than that. Again, I'm nitpicking. I don't even think it needs redesignig, I'm just mentioning it for future projects or so. And if M:CotD wouldn't be an absolutely great game, I wouldn't have taken the time to split hairs. My general opinion was already posted elsewhere.
Last edited by Evan_ on 28 November 2015, 10:29, edited 1 time in total.

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Evan_
Posts: 46
Joined: 27 November 2015, 09:43

Re: General feedback

Postby Evan_ » 28 November 2015, 10:13

<oops, double post>
Last edited by Evan_ on 28 November 2015, 10:28, edited 2 times in total.

Astralwyrm
Posts: 256
Joined: 08 July 2015, 11:47

Re: General feedback

Postby Astralwyrm » 28 November 2015, 10:21

I agree with all your points I think, just a heads up if you fire an equipped mercenary I'm pretty sure you keep their equipment.

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Evan_
Posts: 46
Joined: 27 November 2015, 09:43

Re: General feedback

Postby Evan_ » 28 November 2015, 10:44

Good to know... guess I just distrust the maggots leaving my precious shields and talismans behind when they get booted. :D

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thomas aagaard
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Joined: 26 August 2014, 22:09
Location: Aalborg, Denmark
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Re: General feedback

Postby thomas aagaard » 28 November 2015, 14:46

I agree Totally.

This is warhammer.,. A soldier gets hurt, you take all his gear at throw him out and let the sisters of shallya take care of him... if he survive the trip back to civilization...
Thomas Aagaard
9th Stirland Regiment of Spears...

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hroch
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Joined: 25 December 2014, 19:24
Location: Middle-Eurpoe

Re: General feedback

Postby hroch » 29 November 2015, 11:56

Agree with everything except stealing from unpaid soldiers. Yes, this is cruel world but those guys are sued to live there. They might hide their personal belongings, so you will be unable to find them. So this makes sense from both "fluff" and game mechanic perspective.
Gunslinger & Troubleshooter

majorgoud

Re: General feedback

Postby majorgoud » 06 December 2015, 11:40

hi...

my english is not the best so i try to do it short

after ending a battle because of the enemy flees .... i think itll be a great one if you got a last round for looting the stuff arround you....
same movingpoints as normal and one round only.... because noone left the loot arround his feets after a fight like them in mordheim...

i love the game

greetings

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Drildgen
Posts: 564
Joined: 07 November 2014, 15:32

Re: General feedback

Postby Drildgen » 07 December 2015, 18:34

Greetings majorgoud,

Looting your defeated enemies is part of the strategy. You have to plan ahead if you want to loot a particular enemy, like in Marked for Death secondary objectives for instance. This is crucial to the success of your objective so these actions should definitely be thought out at first.

I hope this clarifies the situation,
Good hunting in the streets of Mordheim!

-Drildgen

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Drildgen
Posts: 564
Joined: 07 November 2014, 15:32

Re: General feedback

Postby Drildgen » 07 December 2015, 19:35

I'm gonna write my answers in *bold* just so it's easier for you to follow... Don't worry, I'm not yelling or trying to make a statement! Hehehe :P
- The most painful part of the game for me is the deployment process. It feels to take much more time as it should. Why can't I click a spot on the map to deploy a unit? Or just the mark ingame? Now if I want a specific starting position, I need to cycle trough a lot, occasionally checking the map if I'm there yet. And their order seems totally random. Hell, it would be better even if I could just walk each unit to the allowed spots.
You know that you can Launch without deploying right? You can completely avoid this feature if you personally don't like it... We have no plans on changing this feature for now.
- Why can't I just take the equipment off a badly injured unit and fire him without starting the treatment? It's not that saving those few gold pieces matter much. The workaround is letting him bleed out in a few days, but than he occupies a reserve slot. That matters less early game, while the GP cost is negligable from mid-game. Yet, allowing to kick the criples would fit the Mordheim mood imho, while being a nice QoL thing.
The Hired Swords Union is quite strong in Mordheim! As all good Warband Manager must, you have to cover your Warriors' health insurance fees. After, if you don't pay their salary, they have the right to abandon your troops with their belongings. But if all dues are paid, you may fire injured units and keep the precious gear you lend them for battling for you. That clause is still under negotiations, you might wanna take advantage of it, as all good Warband Manager would! ;)
- I get the point of those 'zones' next to characters. It's a good mechanic. But why do friendly zones block the 'pick up stuff' or 'climb / jump down' actions? It's annoying, and I don't see why.
As you have noticed, "friendly" control zones are present for many good reasons. The reason why you cannot pick-up stuff, or loot, while standing in such zone is quite simple. Let's pretend, hypothetically, for a second that you just killed an enemy Henchman with your Leader. Unfortunately, your Leader is out of strategy points so he cannot move. You bring one of your Hero up close and with your last Strategy Point, you manage to get to the OOA Henchman's loot point which also happens to be in your Leader's control zone. Your Hero proceeds to loot and is then stuck forever, in a endless loop because he cannot stop his movement in the middle of a friendly control zone but he doesn't have enough strategy points to move out of it. You would then be forced to abandon the battle, with the consequence we know this brings. That is one of the main reasons why we cannot allow you to loot inside the friendly control zone. :)

Now, about Athletic Actions (Jump, Climb & Leap) you should always be able to push 1 (one) unit off of the "Athletic Action Point" in order to perform that action again with another unit. This "Cascade" is limited to a maximum of 1 (one) unit pushed. It might not be possible in some scenarios due to the limited area around the destination point.

- Techical matter: I can't seem to be able to set a fullscreen resolution with 4:3 aspect ratio. Wasn't too big of a problem, I probably could have found a workaround if I did mind the letterbox. Just mentioning it.
Thank you, I passed the info to our development team, but since we clearly don't anticipate a strong return of the 4:3 aspect ratio in the near future, I don't think we'll spend time on this... Hehehe!
- The ingame UI is usable, though I feel it has a learning curve... where all those indicators are hiding and what do they mean. I guess it's explained in the later sections of the tutorials, but the game is too cool to waste time there. A few tooltips would be lovely.
As you mentioned, the information is in the tutorials and you might find it hard to get around the first time you experience the UI. This is something we are aware of and we're making an effort to make quality of life improvements to it, as well as bugfixing, with every patches we deploy.
- The warband menu... that will be long... it feels as chaotic as the city itself. There are redundant pages and obscure looking sub-menus. It's pretty hard to mention everything that felt off, or counter intuitive, as one still gets used to those fast. Well, faster than we mere mortals master the actual gameplay.

The most obvious offender is the 'switch units' submenu. It's annoying, and it would be totally pointless if we could just drag and drop unit icons in the warband screen. Ahh, and it pops up before missions too. Why? We already know to triple-check party composition and equipment before launch, as it's really painful to make mistakes in those. And it shows the 'compact' character sheets. I wonder if there are players who can reliably identify their stats by icons. I just -always- use the 'big' sheet.

Shop menu: couldn't my inventory and the shopkeeper's fit in one screen? It happened to me that I confused those... costy mistake. Well, alt-f4 reverted it, but still. Ok, maybe I'm silly, but that's expected from us end-users. :) Also... I can reach the shop from a unit's inventory screen... I wonder how many of us found that. I wish I had trust in uncharted alternative menus, but I rather click more and use what I'm already familiar with.

Skills menu: it took me a while since I realized it has like 10 sub-menus for the rest of the skills, + other 10 for the passives. Guess it's the silly end-user again who prefers playing and experiencing instead of going trough all the tutorials.

Character sheet: Why can't I spend the stat points on the post-match screen when I receive those? It already cycles trough the units that were in battle, now I need to do that cycling again. Also, clicking like two pixels right from the 'raise intelligence' or 'raise alertness' arrows registers as a 'previous unit' click. Pretty annoying, especially if I don't notice the lack of confirmation popup and think it's done.

All and all, I believe the menu system is the weakest part of the product. That is good. I wish many anticipated AA games wouldn't have bigger problems than that. Again, I'm nitpicking. I don't even think it needs redesignig, I'm just mentioning it for future projects or so. And if M:CotD wouldn't be an absolutely great game, I wouldn't have taken the time to split hairs. My general opinion was already posted elsewhere.
Thank you for all the feedback Evan_ we, at Rogue Factor, really appreciate it. Like I said earlier, we try to improve the GUI but sometimes we're very limited with what can be done without breaking a lot of stuff behind the scene. We will absolutely keep all your feedbacks in mind for the future!

I think this covers all your thoughts and concerns you mentioned in your feedbacks! Feel free to re-poke me if you have other ideas you feel needs answering :)
Good hunting in the streets of Mordheim!

-Drildgen

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hroch
Posts: 117
Joined: 25 December 2014, 19:24
Location: Middle-Eurpoe

Re: General feedback

Postby hroch » 07 December 2015, 21:11

  • I am very sorry to hear that you consider deployment as finished. From my perspective, it is very painful but sill important. It should not be so difficult to allow player to pick position by mouse-click or drag&drop in strategy view in addition to current solution. Those can exist together.
    And honestly, automatic deployments are like automatic battles in Age of Wonders - saves your time when you have clear upper hand. But you loosing tactic aspect of the game + you downgraded AoW into Civilization.
  • I agree with impossibility to "steal" from unpayed warriors.
  • I am convinced that impossibility to loot enemies makes no sense from both game mechanics and "fluff" point of view. If you found it technically difficult, then you can try some workaround - Allow victorious model free loot action regardless of distance and circles of other friendly (not enemy,they should still block) models. This can represent how victor ripped off some trademark items (all that trinkets and stuff) from his foe during fatal blow.
Gunslinger & Troubleshooter


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