When to fire a hero

Discuss about the Skaven of Clan Eshin warriors, builds, skills, equipment, strategy and more!
KillingTime
Posts: 18
Joined: 23 November 2015, 08:58

Re: When to fire a hero

Postby KillingTime » 04 December 2015, 11:54

Thanks for all the good advice.

I suffered another couple of fights with the old Black Skaven before he took yet another serious injury and I was pretty much forced to fire him as he was just a total waste of space.
For the next fight I hired a replacement (level 0), and he was taken out of action almost immediately, but luckily suffered no lasting damage.
However, in the following couple of fights he's gone down quickly, contributing little or nothing to the scrap, and he's also now picked up a bad injury which cost him an OP so he's getting fired too.

I think I'm really not getting the best out of the character at all.
My current preferred build for him is blue light armour, blue helmet, halberd. He always seems to make a couple of good hits on something but then get focussed down in a turn or two before finishing anyone off. It's not like I'm letting him get isolated from the main swarm, but the enemy always seems to hit him hard and fast.
I'm also struggling to get any real benefit from my night runner or sorcerer either and most of my damage dealing is coming from a pimped out poison assassin and three heavy warpguard.

Is it worth saving for a while to get a pre-levelled hired sword when I replace the current batch of heroes?
Currently all they seem to do is provide a big target for the AI which gives my other warriors time to do all the hard work. Which is annoying because my warpguard are all skilled with armour proficiency, shield specialist and flash parry, so that's pretty much supposed to be their job.

Astralwyrm
Posts: 256
Joined: 08 July 2015, 11:47

Re: When to fire a hero

Postby Astralwyrm » 04 December 2015, 12:38

The Black Skaven is really glassy i have had pretty much the same experience as you with him. I don't think he's worth it unless you can get him powered up straight away or otherwise wait till you can buy him at a higher rank. I run my Nightrunners and Sorcerers as pure ranged dps. Reload, overhead mastered and stick them on a building if possible to shoot down from. Sorceror i gave him channeling reload and that poison enchantment spell i forget the name of. I haven't gotten to handing out all my skill points yet. Grabbing a rank 6+ warp guard and turning him into a hero works out really well with some defensive skills.
Last edited by Astralwyrm on 04 December 2015, 14:13, edited 1 time in total.

KillingTime
Posts: 18
Joined: 23 November 2015, 08:58

Re: When to fire a hero

Postby KillingTime » 04 December 2015, 13:35

I've been trying to run the night runner and sorcerer as ranged, but I think I had better use out of the night runner when he had claws. Unfortunately he's also a relatively unskilled hero due to the death of the previous one, and his poor weapon skill just doesn't cut it against the higher ranked warbands I'm now facing so I'm almost forced to use him as a pistoleer.
My sorcerer lost an arm a couple of fights ago which means he can't use warplocks, so he just skulks around with a dagger casting wither and gift of filth, while trying not to get bushwhacked.

I know it would be different on PvP but I'm maintaining a very healthy winning record against the AI, but I feel frustrated that I could be really cruising to crushing victories if I could get the hang of the three heroes.
Last game I played yesterday evening was a case in point:
Opening turns my pair of verminkin scouted out the main warpstone clusters and spotted a few of the enemy.
Black Skaven and Night Runner move to support the verminkin and isolate the enemy advance.
Black Skaven gets the sh*t kicked out of him in a single turn. Night Runner spends most of the game missing or failing to cause much damage. Eventually he holsters the pistols and just starts stabbing things - equally ineffectually.
Vermin try to stay out of melee but get caught and OOA within a few more turns.
Assassin and warpguard slowly steamroll through the enemy, who rout before I can get anyone free to pick up the choicest loot.

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Evan_
Posts: 46
Joined: 27 November 2015, 09:43

Re: When to fire a hero

Postby Evan_ » 04 December 2015, 13:44

I use two black skavens as primary damage dealers along with the assassin, and I'm pretty satisfied with their performance. They bite hard with weeping blades or claws, and warp poison ensures that their target won't fight back.. too much. That skills is so cheap - in terms of gold, study time and effect too.

My skaven tactic is to explore around with warpguards while the heroes are looting safely around the middle of the circle of henchman. Thus the more disposable henchies get engaged first. Once that happens, the available killers go for a target, usually dispose it in one turn, than disappear. I don't even mind sacrificing an attack for a disengage if that saves a hero from being locked in a fight with multiple enemies. Once black skaven get more experienced, I get their warp poison + hit and run mastery, so they'll be able to lock down multiple opponents on the same turn. At this point, they don't even have to fear the big teamfights.

I also keep nightrunners, sorcerers and a rat-ogre in reserve, hopping in when I feel the need for guns, supporting or more tanking, but when the opposition is tough, I trust the above setup to do the heavy part of the engagement.

I generally don't mind kicking units below level 4, while I keep good care of them once they are experienced. Though a big pile of gold, or a half-developed hero in reserve never hurts in case one needs to fill a gap.

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crimsonsun
Posts: 187
Joined: 28 November 2014, 02:43

Re: When to fire a hero

Postby crimsonsun » 08 December 2015, 12:53

I fire my Rats if they take any injury beyond amensia, against all the odds and light would which I allow up to 3 after which they become a liability and I fire them. Anything else is dismissal. Despite this I have a full roster of 2 sorcerer leaders, a Sorcerer normal, a Impressive, a warp guard hero, a vermkin hero, 2 night runners, 3 Vermkin, 2 warp guards and a black rat all at rank 10.
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davinewrath
Posts: 29
Joined: 20 November 2014, 22:17

Re: When to fire a hero

Postby davinewrath » 09 December 2015, 15:43

If the injury doesn't seriously impact on the warrior's role, I'll keep them around. I have a peg-legged Darksoul tank and a one-armed Magister in my Possessed warband. One of my Brethren archers developed Megalomania so he got a great weapon instead and had the honour of leading the charge until he was killed in action. If I was playing competitive multiplayer I'd be harsher on my injured troops, but against the AI they're less of an issue and add character to your warband.

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Morjax
Posts: 178
Joined: 19 September 2014, 16:22
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Re: When to fire a hero

Postby Morjax » 11 December 2015, 21:21

He got too many big injuries, you should fire him or at least use for wyrmstone gathering .
Or rename him "Stumpy the Meatshield"... ;P

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Morjax
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Re: When to fire a hero

Postby Morjax » 11 December 2015, 21:23

I fire my Rats if they take any injury beyond amensia, against all the odds and light would which I allow up to 3 after which they become a liability and I fire them. Anything else is dismissal. Despite this I have a full roster of 2 sorcerer leaders, a Sorcerer normal, a Impressive, a warp guard hero, a vermkin hero, 2 night runners, 3 Vermkin, 2 warp guards and a black rat all at rank 10.
Sounds EXPENSIVE!

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crimsonsun
Posts: 187
Joined: 28 November 2014, 02:43

Re: When to fire a hero

Postby crimsonsun » 11 December 2015, 21:40

I fire my Rats if they take any injury beyond amensia, against all the odds and light would which I allow up to 3 after which they become a liability and I fire them. Anything else is dismissal. Despite this I have a full roster of 2 sorcerer leaders, a Sorcerer normal, a Impressive, a warp guard hero, a vermkin hero, 2 night runners, 3 Vermkin, 2 warp guards and a black rat all at rank 10.
Sounds EXPENSIVE!
Lol moneys not much of an issue any more, though it can be quickly if I'm silly or take a bad game and have 2-3 dead needing replacing but I'd rather trim the weak over invest more into them which doesn't make sense in my mind as you've got a decreasing value product for your investment. Maybe harsh but its the skaven way.
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DarkZany
Posts: 21
Joined: 16 December 2015, 00:34

Re: When to fire a hero

Postby DarkZany » 20 December 2015, 22:12

My simple answer to this is that the warrior whose injuries reduces, limits, or prevents his ability to level a stat that is crucial on him to be successful should be retired and replaced. Or when a warrior gets Stupidity and doesn't have Intelligence as one of his main stats. For instance if you are speccing a warrior to dodge tank and have Side Step level 1 and Avoid level 1 for having 9 Agility and you were going to make him a Side step level 2 and Avoid Level 2 which requires Agility 15... and his max is 15... but his new injury lowers it to 14, then he can't possibly level to Side Step level 2 and Avoid level 2, making him not be able to do his job properly late game, and since you invest a great deal of gold and resources such as time spent playing to level up a character, it would be best to replace him as early as possible so that you can maximize the training time of your new unit. It may also be worth it if you have the gold to replace him with a mercenary that has points to spend so you're not put that far behind.

Anytime I get Stupidity... and the character doesn't have high intelligence... it's just time to let him go.

With all that said, it's actually interesting to look at this thread as a theory crafting thread for me, since I don't get injuries and don't lose units much any more.


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